Some time ago Louis Farakan called for a million black men to march on Washington. Farakan is a Black Muslim and the name of his religion is The Nation Of Islam. Farakan's purpose in organizing and carrying out this event was ultimately to convert as many Black men as possible to The Nation Of Islam. Part of his strategy for doing so was to tell Christians that after all Christians and Muslims worship the same God. Muslims worship Allah, Christians worship Jehovah, and Allah and Jehovah are actually the same God. I heard one of the speakers at the march state this plainly.

When I served as a chaplain at Oklahoma State Reformatory, a medium security prison, I had a lot of personal dealings with Black Muslims. Time and again these Muslims told me that Allah of Islam is the same as Jehovah of the Bible.

What is Islam? Islam is a religion founded in 622 AD by Mohammed. The word Islam means submission to Allah and a Muslim is a person who is in submission to Allah. The most basic statement of Islamic belief is "There is no God but Allah and Mohammed is his prophet."

Islam is one of the world's major religions. One out of every five persons on the face of the earth today is a Muslim. Islam is the fastest growing religion in the world. Islam is the fastest growing religion in America today. Mosques or places of Islamic worship are being built in all our major cities. There is a large mosque with a tall minaret just down the street from our church in Kansas City. According to "American Demographics" magazine in a 1994 article, Muslims now outnumber Presbyterians in the United States. By the year 2010 Islam will move ahead of Judaism to be the second largest religion in America. The growth of Islam in America will soon mean that we can no longer define ourselves as a Judeo-Christian society.

A large part of the growth of Islam in this country has been among Black people. Black Muslims have been busy over the last 30 years or so propagating Islam in our prisons and our inner cities.

The question we want to try to answer in this message is this: Is the god of Islam the God of the Bible? Do Muslims and Christians actually worship the same God? Let's look at some of the teachings of Islam and see if as they claim the god of Islam is the God of the Bible.

The Christian doctrine that Islam most fiercely attacks is the doctrine of the Trinity of the Godhead. Islam's sacred book, the Koran, is divided into chapters and verses and the chapters are called Suras that, along with the verses, are numbered so that specific passages may be easily found.

Sura 4 verse 169 says that Christians worship three gods; God, Jesus and Mary. Sura 5:73 denies that there is a Trinity in the Godhead and says that those who say that God is a Trinity will be severely punished. "Surely they are disbelievers those who said: Allah is one of the three in a Trinity. But there is none who has the right to be worshipped but one God (Allah). And if they cease not from what they say verily a painful torment will befall the disbelievers among them."

My friend Scott Wiegner was in the U. S. Air Force and went to Saudi Arabia in connection with Operation Desert Shield and the Persian Gulf War. While he was in Dhahran the Saudi government gave our service men and women a book, a copy of which I have here, entitled "Christian Muslim Dialogue." This book is a blatant attempt by Muslims to proselyte our service men and women to Islam.

On page 16 of this book is the statement: "The Trinity is not biblical. The word Trinity is not even in the Bible or Bible dictionaries, was never taught by Jesus and was never mentioned by him. There is no basis or proof in the Bible whatsoever for the acceptance of the Trinity." The Koran says that Jesus Christ was A son of God like anybody else is a son of God but that he is not God the Son. Sura 19:29 says "It is not meet for Allah, that he should have any son. Allah forbid!" The book "Christian Muslim Dialogue" says on page iii "The reader will be surprised to learn that in the Bible Jesus never claimed to be God."

Islam sees Jesus Christ as a prophet of God who otherwise is no different from other men. The Koran says in Sura 43:59 "Jesus was no more than a mortal whom (Allah) favored and made an example to the Israelites." According to Sura 61:6 the main significance of Jesus is that he prophesied the coming of Mohammed. All Muslim commentators teach that Jesus' promise of the coming of the Comforter in John 16:7 is a prophecy that Mohammed would come. John 16:7 Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you. John 14:26 But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.

The Bible, God's holy word, teaches that Jesus Christ was and is far more than "a mortal." Colossians 2:9 says of Jesus Christ "For in him dwelleth all the fullness of the Godhead bodily." In John 10:30 the Lord Jesus Christ says "I and my Father are one." In John 14:9 the Lord Jesus says "He that hath seen me hath seen the Father." In Matthew 17:5 God the Father said from heaven in an audible voice concerning Jesus Christ: "This is my Beloved Son in whom I am well pleased. Hear ye him."

In Matthew 22:42 there is a question upon which hangs the eternal destiny of every person in this world. "What think ye of Christ? Whose Son is he?" Take away the deity of Jesus Christ, the fact that he is the Son of God and God the Son and salvation is impossible. I John 5:10-12 says, "He that believeth on the Son of God hath the witness in himself: he that believeth not God hath made him a liar; because he believeth not the record that God gave of his Son. And this is the record that God hath given to us eternal life, and this life is in his Son. He that hath the Son hath life; and he that hath not the Son of God hath not life."

Islam teaches that God is not the Father of Jesus Christ but the Bible says that he is. Therefore the god of Islam is not the God of the Bible.

Islam teaches that the Holy Spirit is not God. It teaches that the Holy Spirit is the angel Gabriel and that through Gabriel God gave his revelations to the prophets. In the book "Christian Muslim Dialogue" on page 18 we find these words: "Read Matthew 1:18. Now the birth of Jesus Christ was on this wise: When as his mother Mary was espoused to Joseph, before they came together, she was found with child of the Holy Ghost. Compare (this) now with Luke 1:26-27. ‘And in the sixth month the angel Gabriel was sent from God unto a city of Galilee, named Nazareth, To a virgin espoused to a man whose name was Joseph, of the house of David; and the virgin's name was Mary.’ So in the miraculous birth of Jesus, Matthew mentioned the Holy Ghost and Luke mentioned the angel Gabriel. What is the Holy Ghost then? The Holy Ghost is then the angel Gabriel...Then God is God, the Holy Ghost or the Holy Spirit is the angel Gabriel, and Jesus is...let me help you: Jesus is a prophet, son of Mary."

The Bible, God's holy word, teaches that God is a Trinity. He is three Persons; Father, Son and Holy Spirit, yet he is one God. In Matthew 28:19 the Lord Jesus says, "Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name (singular) of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost." One name yet three persons in that name. I John 5:7 says "For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one."

The Bible speaks of the Father as God, it speaks of the Son as God and it speaks of the Holy Spirit as God. Yet Christians do not believe that there are three Gods or to quote the Koran that God is "a third of three." The Bible says in Deuteronomy 6:4 that "the Lord our God is one Lord..."

Christians worship the God of the Bible who is the Triune God. This is the only God who exists. The God of Islam is not a Trinity; therefore the God of Islam is not the God of the Bible.

"Christian Muslim Dialogue" says on page iii "The reader will be surprised to learn that in the Bible Jesus...did not die on the cross..." Islam says that Jesus Christ was not crucified but that God caused someone else who looked like him, probably Judas, to be crucified and that, instead of being crucified, Jesus was taken up by Allah into heaven. Sura 4:157-158 says "...They slew him not nor crucified, but it appeared so unto them...they slew him not for certain, But Allah took him unto Himself..." Islam denies that Christ died a sacrificial death for his people therefore Islam denies that Jesus Christ is the Redeemer.

The Bible teaches that Jesus Christ was crucified and his crucifixion and resurrection is the basic message of the Bible. About 1/3rd of the words in the four gospels are given to eyewitness accounts of the death and resurrection of Jesus Christ. The basic essential message of the Bible is the gospel of Jesus Christ, his death on the cross for sinners, His burial and his resurrection from the dead.

In I Corinthians 15:1-4 the apostle Paul defines the gospel as the death, burial and resurrection of Jesus Christ. "Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand; By which also ye are saved...how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures..."

The very reason Jesus Christ was born into this world was in order to die for the sins of his people. I John 4:10 says, "Herein is love, not that we loved God, but that he loved us, and sent his Son to be the propitiation for our sins." The Lord Jesus himself says in Mark 10:45, "For even the Son of man came not to be ministered unto, but to minister, and to give his life a ransom for many."

The apostle Paul says in I Corinthians 1:23 that the death of Christ is what the apostles preached. "But we preach Christ crucified..." In I Corinthians 2:2 Paul says he was determined to preach the cross of Christ above everything else when he said "For I determined not to know any thing among you, save Jesus Christ, and him crucified." The one thing God's people glory in is the redeeming death of Jesus Christ on the cross. Galatians 6:14 says, "But God forbid that I should glory, save in the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ..."

The Bible teaches that from birth man is a sinner and cannot save nor help save himself. He must have a substitute to atone for him and the only substitute God will accept is Jesus Christ and his death on the cross. The death of Christ is the only means of salvation. It is the only means of reconciliation to God. Without the crucifixion God's word makes clear there is no forgiveness of sin and no eternal life. If Jesus Christ did not die on the cross and rise from the dead there is very little left of the Christian faith. Paul says in I Corinthians 15:13-17 "But if there be no resurrection of the dead, then is Christ not risen: And if Christ be not risen, then is our preaching vain, and your faith is also vain. Yea, and we are found false witnesses of God; because we have testified of God that he raised up Christ: whom he raised not up, if so be that the dead rise not. For if the dead rise not, then is not Christ raised: And if Christ be not raised, your faith is vain; ye are yet in your sins."

Islam denies the basic, essential message of the Bible, the crucifixion and resurrection of Jesus Christ. In doing so it has taken away the Savior and has rejected God's saving grace. Islam says it has a high regard for Jesus as a prophet of Allah but no amount of respect for Jesus as a prophet can be acceptable to God when the Person and work of Jesus Christ are not the heart and substance of faith.

ISLAM HAS A FATALISTIC VIEW OF THE UNIVERSE

Like the Bible, Islam teaches a doctrine of predestination but Islam's predestination bears little resemblance to the predestination taught in the Bible. Islam places so much emphasis on God as the sole cause of all events that second causes are all but excluded.

Islam teaches a predestination of the ends regardless of means. So determined by predestination is every event in a person's life that there is little place for moral responsibility or guilt. Sura 6:39 says, "Allah will lead into error whom he pleaseth, and whom he pleaseth he will put in the right way." Sura 13:33 says, "None can guide those whom Allah has led astray. They shall be punished in this life; but more painful is the punishment of the life to come."

Islamic predestination is a doctrine of inevitable necessity. Fatalism is the proper term to describe it. A Turkish proverb expresses the fatalism of Islam's doctrine of predestination when it says "A man cannot escape what is written on his forehead."

One time I read a story about a ship that was crowded with Englishmen and Muslims. As the ship plowed through the waves a man fell overboard. The Muslims on board watched the floundering man indifferently saying, "If it is written in the book of destiny that this man shall be saved, he will be saved without our help and if it is written that he shall perish, there is nothing we can do," so they left him in the water. The Englishmen said, "Maybe it is written in the book of destiny that we should save this man" so they threw him a lifeline and he was saved.

Islam denies any predestination when it comes to election. Islam denies that there has ever been any election in Christ Jesus to salvation.

The Bible teaches that God has predestined all things that come to pass in this world but it also teaches that God uses second causes to bring his ends to pass. God uses means to bring about his holy purposes in this world. "…We know that all things work together for good to them that love God, to them who are the called according to his purpose," says Romans 8:28.

God has predestined a certain time for people to die and nothing can cause them to die before that predestined time but God also preserves people alive through the use of second causes. God has predestined the time when I shall die and nothing shall ever change that predestinated time but if I'm standing on a railroad track and a train comes by, I'm going to get off the track so the train won't hit me because God uses means such as my caution to preserve me till the predestined time of my death.

Ephesians 1:4-5 in the Bible says that God has an elect people whom he has predestinated unto the adoption of children by himself. "According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will..."

The spread of Islam through the centuries has been carried out largely on the battlefield. Islam has been advanced by the widespread use of war, torture and force of arms. Islam has swept over the world slaughtering Jews and Christians alike. The choice of all nations over which Islamic hordes have swept in history has been conversion to Islam or death.

Islam is a fighting religion. Conquest is a religious duty in Islam. The Koran urges Muslims to take up arms against the infidel. "When ye encounter unbelievers, strike off their heads until ye have made a great slaughter among them, and bind them in bonds..." the Koran says. Kill thine enemy! is the practical teaching of Islam.

The Bible says that God's work is not to be spread by means of the sword. In John 18:36 the Lord Jesus said to Pontius Pilate "My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight..." In Matthew 26:52 the Lord Jesus says "all they that take the sword shall perish with the sword" II Corinthians 10:3-4 says concerning Christians, "For though we walk in the flesh, we do not war after the flesh: (For the weapons of our warfare are not carnal, but mighty through God to the pulling down of strong holds;)0" In Matthew 5:44 the Lord Jesus tells his people to love their enemies. "But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you." True Christianity is a peaceful religion and a peaceable religion. "Blessed are the peacemakers: for they shall be called the children of God," says the Lord Jesus in Matthew 5:9.

Muslims never tire of reminding people that in the Crusades "Christians" swept over the holy land slaughtering Jews and Muslims by the hundreds of thousands. People need to keep in mind however that the Crusades were Roman Catholic crusades and that all Christians may not fairly be lumped with Roman Catholics. God's work, true Christianity, biblical Christianity has always been spread, not by the sword, not by war and torture and military might, but by the weakest men, unarmed with anything but humility, love, God's word and holy lives.

CONCLUSION

Is the god of Islam the God of the Bible? Are Allah and Jehovah one and the same? Clearly the answer is, No! According to the Bible Allah is not God, Mohammed is not his prophet, and the Koran is not the word of God. Islam is a false religion and utterly without power to save from sin because it doesn't recognize Jesus Christ as the Savior! No person, no matter how religious or how sincere he may be can possess truth or salvation apart from Jesus Christ the Savior!

The Person and work of Christ is the crucial divider between Christianity and Islam. Christ's death is the perfect and only sacrifice that God will accept in behalf of sinners. Acts 4:12 says, "There is none other name under heaven given among men whereby we must be saved." Bow to Christ today sinner. Surrender to the God of the Bible, the only true God!

In this ecumenical age most people want to emphasize the resemblance and similarities between Islam & Christianity. The two religions do share many historical persons and events in common but still there is an unbridgeable gulf between them. There is no possible compromise between biblical Christianity and Islam and none should be sought!

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Think of it!

A busy pastor, who believes the "Mother– daughter" theory for establishing churches, is studying. He opens a history book and traces the lineage of his church. Suddenly, he finds the great-grandmother church in the lineage of his church was self-constituted!

His church has baptized scores of people, ordained several preachers, and constituted numbers of churches and these churches have constituted other churches. Churches have been started from these churches, all vowing you must have church authority to start a church and without authority from a mother church there can be no true church!

This shocking discovery means his church is not a true church!

It means no one ever baptized by this church is baptized scripturally!

It means no one ever received by this church is really a member of Christ’s church!

It means no one ever took the Lord’s Supper in this assembly!

It means no one ever worshiped the Lord in this church in spirit and truth!

It means no one ever built on the true foundation in this church!

It means no church started by this church is a true church!

It means no preacher ordained by this church is ordained!

Think of the churches that depend on this church for their maternity. This "mother church" and the churches started out of this church all teach you must have "mother-church" authority to start a church. Now he knows that all his insistence on this point is worthless because somewhere up the line the link was severed for at some crucial point this authority was neither sought nor granted! This is not a hypothetical case but the actual situation in scores of churches which can trace their history, and in all of them that can’t! At best these which can’t trace their history only assume their ancestral churches were constituted with church authority because the records do not state they were so constituted!

What about the many who will never learn of this "missing link" until they get to glory and find out that even though they labored for the Lord faithfully in church capacity, "walking in all the commandments and ordinances of the Lord blameless" yet they were never scripturally baptized, never a church member, never observed the supper, never worshiped in spirit and truth and consequently were only saved "so as by fire!" Why? Simply because somewhere up the line some church did not get authority to constitute! One can see not only the impracticability but also the impossibility of such a doctrine.

Now this preacher’s doctrine demands he correct this mess!

Can he do it?

Will he even attempt it?

Let me tell you how most of these brethren handle such problems. They will say, we accept by faith, that things were done up the line of history according to our theory. They do this when they know History denies what they demand! This is a thing of ignorance at best and deception at worst. It is flatly wrong no matter whether deception or ignorance is ruling! He who goes on insisting on every church having a "mother church," excluding from fellowship those who don’t agree, when he knows [or can easily know] he does not have what he insists others must have, does not dwell in an enviable place!

These brethren will continue to sell their theory to those they are baptizing, organizing, ordaining and teaching, when fifteen minutes with a Baptist History book would prove that not one of their baptisms, not one of their organizations, not one of their ordinations is valid according to their own theory! So much hangs on this connection of "mother-daughter authority" that no adherent can fail to make this search!

This challenge is not to make fun of their predicament but to awaken them to the false principle that boondoggles them. First let them find a single list of such churches in History which ever heard of this theory, much less practiced it! This alone will drive them from their illusion. Every such attempt will, up the stream, end in a self-constituted church! Tradition stacked on tradition, theory built on theory, precise wording, and exacting execution of constitution form and format, according to the present theory, will all come tumbling down on their heads when they find a church ancestor which is expressly said to be self constituted! This whole system will then be seen for the mere tradition it is! This theory cannot be sustained for it is a fact that most of the churches which depend on this "mother- daughter authority" do not have it! Where will they go to find this unbroken "mother-daughter" church-to- church authority for three hundred years?

The silence of the authority brethren on this subject indicates their consternation! Their silence is a mute admission of their error. They are confounded and astonished. They look about for help and because they can find none I purpose to give them aid. Let them do the following:

1. Let them define their terms. For years the authority brethren have claimed every kind of connection in History with any other church as "mother-church authority." It is always a mystery when men do not like to define their terms. Therefore let them do this now. They will no longer seek this authority in such terms as "helps," "arm," "ripe," "advised," "approbation," "support," "sanction" or in pastors, elders, presbyteries, councils, associations, or church letters granted for the purpose of constitution or in church splits, but only when a church specifically and directly states she gives authority to a group to constitute and without this authority not church can be constituted. After all, this is what they demand now. Nothing else will suffice for real constitution according to this theory. When so much hangs upon so little, care must be taken that that little is the real thing! Is it wrong to demand in the root what is required in the branch? Defining their terms will do to their history what a broken dam does to a reservoir.

In the meanwhile, let them remember and remember well, that our position will allow for all of these irregularities in church constitution because Christ does the constituting when scripturally baptized people covenant together according to Mt 18:20. As He alone can remove the candlestick, Re 2:5, when a church departs from the faith or right practice, just so He alone can place the candlestick, Mt 16:18; I Cor. 3:9-11; I Pet 2:5. He does this when some of the members of His kingdom "gather together in His Name." In no case is the placing or removal of the candlestick of a church in the hands of a church! Churches may recognize the act of Christ but they have no power to effect or prevent. Churches may pretend but they are as powerless to accomplish the fact, as they are to produce light. They can no more remove than they can place! The act is a Divine fiat and none but Christ can do it! Re 1:20.

Let the Authority brethren be frank and honest and admit that they have not been able to find in the NT a single expressed declaration which sets forth the "mother-daughter" constitution of churches. Some have already done this and we salute them. Dr. A.T. Bledsoe, a Methodist, said: "With all our searching, we have been unable to find in the New Testament a single expressed declaration or word in favor of infant baptism. We justify the rite, therefore, wholly on the ground of logical inference, and not on any expressed word of Christ and His apostles. " — Quoted in What Baptists Believe, Wallace, p. 160. The Authority brethren take the same position on the constitution of churches and they all ought to be as honest as was Dr. Bledsoe.

2. Let them make an honest search of the lineage of their respective churches. As the search was made for the register of the priests for the children of Barzillai and when it was not found, they were put out of the priesthood as polluted, so let these brethren do with their own churches, [Neh. 7:63-64]. If they find in their traceable lineage a church which was self-constituted or constituted out of a split, constituted by a single man, constituted by an association, or where the authority was not specifically granted, or where there was no "mother church" (and all such is anathema to them) let them honestly admit this, and let them set about to reconstitute all the churches involved, correct all the baptisms, ordinations and every official act of these churches which are still in existence! {Editor’s note: Since such a church has found itself to be, according to its standards, unscriptural as to its lineage, it is in no position to correct its problem and must find a church with a perfect linked-chain succession to make the corrections.} More they cannot do. Less would be an abomination. Such a search will, I believe, unchurch every church in the land, given their theory! The mere stating of the case presents such absurdities, contradictions, and impossibilities, that every thinking man will see the error of the whole theory instantly!

3. Let them seek to make a "mother church" certification. Let them find a particular church with a traceable lineage as far back as distinct records go that has always used the authority theory and let this be verified. Once done, let all their churches without such a lineage be reconstituted by this "mother church," to insure and confirm they are scriptural churches indeed! Let this church be used as the "mother church" for all future constitutions to prevent any problems. For these men contend with all their power that any church which does not have "a mother church authority" cannot be a true church. They could then insist on this "certified mother church authority." Why tolerate and perpetuate mongrels when you can have pedigreed stock? Why be a part of a church with a question mark as to its mother on this essential issue when you can have "certified mother authority?"

4. Let these men develop an official registry of churches. Why should they accept non- pedigreed churches for fellowship—churches which are known to have descended from self-constituted churches—when they argue no true church ever descended from such a church and none ever can? Many of these authority churches trace their lineage through churches which under no circumstances had authority to constitute but they fellowship with them now because these churches, in spite of their lineage, illogically hold to this position! These records are available and can be examined. Where there is not this "mother-daughter" connection in the lineage, all daughter churches to the end of time are not true churches and cannot be fellowshipped any more than a Lutheran church. These records would of course be careful to show that each church was constituted by the authority of another church. It would give, not generalities, but specific dates, names and places, as far as records go back. This registry would then be made available to all the churches and any church not on the list could not preach, baptize, or constitute churches any more than can the Mormons or Jehovah’s Witnesses! This inquiry as to this certified lineage would be a standing question on all church communications, such as requests for letters of transfer, meetings, ordinations and so on. No certified lineage, no fellowship. The theory demands it!

5. Let these brethren divorce themselves from the Landmark Baptists of the 19^th century because those old landmarkers opposed the Authority Theory. This should be as easy for them to do as it is for them to exclude those of us now who do not believe this theory! But alas! There is a reluctance in these brethren to bid their goodbyes to Graves, Pendleton, Dayton and hosts of others! They know they ought to do it but cannot bring themselves to do it! Not one of them can produce a line from the writings of these men to support the authority theory but we have given much from their pens which shows they flatly opposed the Authority Theory. But if they will be honest, they must make public this break with the Old Landmarkers!

6. Let them be honest enough to state they are not the same people as the Old Landmarkers. They will, in this statement, spell out wherein they differ from them. They will be careful to draw a distinction between themselves and what the Old Landmarkers believed so that there can be no confusion, for many Baptists assume they are the same in doctrine. Honest men do not hesitate to publish their position. It is cults and the like who hate to admit who they are and what they believe!

7. Let these brethren thank those of us who have pointed out these things to them for they have misread the Old Landmarkers for years. The Old Landmarkers held to a method for the constitution of churches which is spelled out in Mt 18:20. Graves states this in Old Landmarkism. Pendleton expressly states the same thing in his Manual. Dayton specifies it over and over in Theodosia Earnest, Vol. II, but the authority brethren deny this method of church constitution and heap reproach on all who teach it! Therefore they should be most thankful to us for calling their attention to the error of the Old Landmarkers concerning this issue as they see it. Honest men appreciate it when their attention is called to some mistake or error they have made. They have heretofore claimed Graves, Pendleton, Dayton, Jarrel, Bogard, and hosts of other Old Landmark Baptists as men who believed and defended the authority theory. But this is not the case at all. These men opposed the authority theory and the authority brethren were wrong in saying these men agreed with them. But instead of thanking us, they have used every form of hateful device they can find (and they are rather good at finding these) and have hurled them against us! Why? Do they not love truth? Do they not want to know what these men really believed? I cannot then understand this unthankfulness. Can you?

8. Let the authority brethren find one church in history which was reorganized because it did not have "church authority" from a "mother church" to constitute! We can find churches reorganized because they were sprinkled, or because they were baptized by those who were only sprinkled. But where is the record of a church reorganized because they were not given church authority to organize? Surely if the Authority theory is true, there must have been countless cases in History where a Baptist church was reconstituted because it failed to get this essential authority! Especially is this true when we have so many specific records of self-constituted churches. Surely we are not to think, granting for the sake of discussion their theory, that on this score, there has been a perpetual unity and that no Baptists ever deviated from this "Mother-daughter" concept. Surely they can find just one!

But if they cannot find these certified church lines—and they cannot—then let them publicly state the case. Let them fairly and honestly say, "We do not constitute in this manner as an essential but as a tradition, and we know churches can be scripturally constituted without it! We take this position that a ‘mother-daughter’ authority is not essential because we know churches in our lineage were not constituted with a ‘mother-church’ therefore it cannot be essential today." This will heal all the wounds, correct all the false impressions, and re-establish the truth making harmony and peace roll like a river!

If they refuse, what then? Only a fool will cut off the limb which supports his whole weight. Yet these brethren are furiously sawing on the only limb in their tree by contending you must have a "mother church" for the proper constitution of a church! They had as well claim it is essential to have Peter’s bones under your pulpit in order to be a Scriptural church! These brethren will find one as easy to obtain and as easy to verify as the other.

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The Muslim author admits that John 1:1 teaches the deity of Christ but arrays other verses against it in an attempt to show there is a contradiction. In doing this, he not only denies the deity of Jesus Christ, but also denies the inspiration of the Holy Scriptures. That is for another time for the Doctor uses six pages to deny that the Bible is holy. He resorts to the tricks of the atheists who seek out seeming contradictions in Scripture and array them before those who believe in the triune God of the Bible. Isaiah 8:20 To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.

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COLORADO: Pastor Camp...

 I just had to drop you a note and tell you how much I appreciate your stand against heresy and false teachings within the "Christian" churches.  I read your articles about the Promise Keepers and our requirements to judge and discern these false doctrines.  Your other articles appear to be just as uncompromising and RIGHT ON TARGET!  You are without a doubt a very anointed, biblically sound, and godly man.

I am also of the Baptist faith, but regard many things being done within our body as dangerous and compromising.  I see many dangers within the church today that MUST be brought to the attention of the congregation.  Reading your articles gave me the impression that I was reading one of my own articles!  What a joy and uplifting feeling I received from this confirmation that I am not alone!

Thank you, Pastor, for your honesty, courage, and strong convictions on these topics!

If you would visit our Sword of the Spirit Apologetics website, I would be deeply honored.  We confront the false doctrines of the Mormons, JW's, Masonic Lodge, and false charismatic and ecumenical Word of Faith Movement.  I would love to have some feedback from you!!

Pastor Camp, God bless you and your family as you continue in His service!

WWW: You my friend are totally deceived. Do you have nothing else to do but write about this? Your site is disgusting and misleading. If you call yourself a Christian you should gather your thoughts and reconsider what you have written. Oh well, there are a lot of narrow minded individuals out there like yourself.

Get a Life brother! put away your hatred and grow up! Time to embrace the Lord and humankind.

Dear Darren Sweet,

I was embraced by the Lord long ago and he grows more precious to me as the years go by. But, he has warned us to be sober and vigilant against false religious movements. You in no way identified what writings of mine you are referencing in your letter. I have many articles on many subjects on the WebSite. However, I suspect you are another of those sweet, kind, loving, non-judgmental, Promise Keepers who regularly write and judge me to be a lost man because I oppose your organization. If I am correct you violate the very spirit that PKs are supposed to exude. This makes you a hypocrite.

WWW: Subject: you sound lost

I feel sorry for you; you say many things to qualify yourself to bad mouth Promise Keepers.This must be an old web page(last updated Dec.18,2000)Maybe you have been saved by now?I hope so then I could call you brother and identify on a more level ground.I didn't read all but after your first few hippo's I had already JUDGED YOU>you see judge not lest you be judged and by what measure you judge well you get it. At first i went to your page cause i thought you might have something but you speak with no love.And i kwow that if you have not love you have nothing/what do you have?

Please do some more research and remember that the Baptist church as you know it was also formed by humans.

In truth / A Lover of Jesus Christ

                             Bill Johnson.

Dear Bill,

I thought PKs were supposed to be loving and non-judgmental. Your letter is certainly evidence that what I have written on the PKs movement is true. There is an arrogance and self-righteousness that glares out from most letters I get from you guys. 

I was saved by God’s wonderful grace over 50 years ago and nothing you say can change that. You mention that the WebPage was last updated in December of 2000 as if time might change the truth about the PKs that I have exposed.

 You admit you did not read the entire page. This is another oft-revealed action of PKs who write to me. They examine little of the evidence and then judge my entire WebSite on the basis of part of one article they read. Of course, none of the hundreds who have written reflect anything like a mature view of the Word of God. Most are shallow and have never dug into the meat of the Word. A lot of bark but no bite. 

I truly feel sorry for you.

 As to the origin of the Baptist churches you are also ignorant. But, I do not have time to teach you, especially since you would probably only read a line or two and then fire off another condemnatory letter.

WWW: Hello,  God is so good.  Just this evening I was traveling home and feeling so isolated.  For a few years back the Lord used me to expose the Promise Keepers error in my church and community.  I could have been stoned and probably not hurt anymore than I did during that time.  But tonite I was pondering all the opportunities that God gave me to expose this and was feeling somewhat dismayed as I realize most people who see me now think I have gone off the deep end.  Well, after reading your message I would rather be off the deep end than thrown into the deep end!  Thank you and may the Lord bless you. Hello,  God is so good.  Just this evening I was traveling home and feeling so isolated.  For a few years back the Lord used me to expose the Promise Keepers error in my church and community.  I could have been stoned and probably not hurt anymore than I did during that time.  But tonite I was pondering all the opportunities that God gave me to expose this and was feeling somewhat dismayed as I realize most people who see me now think I have gone off the deep end.  Well, after reading your message I would rather be off the deep end than thrown into the deep end!  Thank you and may the Lord bless you.

ILLINOIS: Greetings in the holy name of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. I would like to request for the monthly subscription of your Church's paper, "The Grace Proclamator and Promulgator." I came across this paper through some faithful brethren from the Sovereign Grace Baptist Churches in Seattle and Illinois. The Lord's messages from this church paper will surely be of great value not only to our personal studies, but also to our teaching ministry in the Lord's churches and Philippine missions that He has entrusted to us.

Thank you so much and may the Lord's manifold blessings be upon you, to the family and to everyone in the Church.

IOWA: I am enclosing a name that would really like to receive your paper each month. I have received you paper for several years and really enjoy it.

OKLAHOMA: I just wanted to drop you a note to let you know how much I appreciate your article in the July issue entitled "Salvation by Grace Authenticated." I thought you did an excellent job in dealing with the sovereignty of God and His grace in the matter of the salvation of sinners. Thank you for your faithful stand on the truth.

TENNESSEE: I want you to know that I surely enjoy your articles and pictures related to the mission work in Thailand. It is very interesting.

INDIANA: Bro. Camp, we voted to send you $500 to be used in the mission work in Thailand as you see fit. We receive The Grace Proclamator and Promulgator each month and we saw and felt the need to help in the work. We pray that the Lord will continue to bless in the mission work and the church you pastor there in Memphis.

FLORIDA: I have enjoyed your paper for many years now and it is my prayer that you continue to proclaim the truth in our Lord and Savior's name.

WWW: I don't believe that you have an accurate understanding of the Promise Keepers or of our saviour, Jesus Christ.  You may need to study more and not watch quite so much TV.  Have you ever been to a PK event.  What spirit was it that you perceived proclaiming Jesus as the only hope, the only way, the fullness of diety etc.  Test the spirits brother!

EDITOR’S REPLY: I am amazed at the presumption of some PKs. I watch very little TV. I study God’s precious word many more hours than I watch TV. Some people criticize me for being judgmental but are so bold as to judge me to be a watcher of too much TV when they know absolutely nothing of my watching habits. I am aghast at your presumptuous attitude. You would do well to pray as did David. Psalm 19:13 Keep back thy servant also from presumptuous sins; let them not have dominion over me: then shall I be upright, and I shall be innocent from the great transgression.

Of course, one of the characteristics of false teachers is their presumptuous actions. 2 Peter 2:10 But chiefly them that walk after the flesh in the lust of uncleanness, and despise government. Presumptuous are they, selfwilled, they are not afraid to speak evil of dignities.

You admonish me to "try the spirits" and that is exactly what I have done in the articles I have written about your movement. I tried them by the Word of God and they were found wanting in origin, doctrine and practice. In fact, it seems you do NOT want me to try the spirits when it comes to the unscriptural PKs movement.

WWW: I feel sorry for you and your convoluted reasoning shown on this web site. It is written out of ignorance. You are ignorant of what Promise Keepers is about. I will pray that God would heal your thinking.

your really mad about this!   and i'll pray for you.. not once did you mention LOVE.  LOVE will overcome....Go to the Kights of Columbus web and get some new thinking...I have been to a promise keepers conference and can tell you that what you have spewed is quite contrary to what they are trying to enlighten men towards
Any attempt to gather men together for the greater good of the word of jesus can only promote love...and they do that..PERIOD!

Get real  what have you done personally to promote the word of god?  Is your words spoken through love? I think not!   I personally know a witness whom worked daily alongside Mother Theresa and can tell you quite factually she was a living saint..what have you done personally to phisically aid your fellow man!  not much i think...have you provided anything for the porest of the poor?  

I will pray for your anger to turn to LOVE...GOD BLESS AMERICA!

WWW: I feel sorry for you; you say many things to qualify yourself to bad mouth Promise Keepers.This must be an old web page(last updated Dec.18,2000)Maybe you have been saved by now?I hope so then I could call you brother and identify on a more level ground.I didn't read all but after your first few hippo's I had already JUDGED YOU>you see judge not lest you be judged and by what measure you judge well you get it. At first i went to your page cause i thought you might have something but you speak with no love.And i kwow that if you have not love you have nothing/what do you have?

Please do some more research and remember that the Baptist church as you know it was also formed by humans.

In truth / A Lover of Jesus Christ

EDITOR’S NOTE: After I wrote to this correspondent about three times, he wrote as follows:

Dear Pastor Wayne

Your web site is a blessing and it is so nice to hear of a man that has been given successful children. It is always nice to rejoice with good news about others lives. I enjoy you choice of music it is very uplifting and helps to stay focused to the task at hand (the truth).

 I have read much more on the P K's and will be doing some of my own investigating especially on this Hicks fellow and the truth to what you have said about all involved. It of course is very disturbing and I will not be swayed away from the Way the Truth and the Light.

 I have been saved; and forgiven of MUCH and I am extreamly greatful.

 If it were not for other Christ led or inspired people (wether they knew it or not)I would not have made it through my speckled life choices.

Wayne-Please, in the future season your first words with love as not to turn them away from the truth that you are trying to reveal. I still don't agree with all you say but i am a maturing Christian of about 5 years. I am 38 married 8 yrs. and have 4 children.

Looking to Jesus,

A friend and not a Foe (paegan)